Since a while I have been having some great conversations with Kati Heck. We first met at her studio next to a portrait of herself as an ape that she had just finished. This somehow set the tone for the conversations that followed. Two weeks ago, the catalog of her recent show was published and it features a conversation between the two of us. As a game, I proposed we read Kati's show from the perspective of Donna Haraway’s 2003 book ‘Primate Visions’. Book published but conversation ongoing, to be continued next year at DE SINGEL.